tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37940560.post7704127362391367127..comments2024-03-27T08:49:38.786-03:00Comments on Siskoid's Blog of Geekery: Star Trek 565: Latent ImageSiskoidhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/08266365376486695812noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37940560.post-43589478081965662232008-06-25T22:19:00.000-03:002008-06-25T22:19:00.000-03:00snell: yeah, I do realise now that that was your p...snell: yeah, I do realise now that that was your point, but when I started typing up my comment, yours had yet to appear (check the close times). The moment I saw both our comments come up, I do have to say I felt that I looked rather foolish for essentially repeating what you'd said, but far less eloquently. Sorry :/Jayunderscorezerohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16611897906121531154noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37940560.post-51083153830973524572008-06-25T13:29:00.000-03:002008-06-25T13:29:00.000-03:00I think the episode (and a lot of the "edgy Janewa...I think the episode (and a lot of the "edgy Janeway" stories besides) could have work with a softer, kinder Janeway.<BR/><BR/>The problem isn't that she made those controversial decisions, it's that she defended them without any kind of reasonable or sympathetic argument. It's always "because I said so", and that deflates any kind of ethical dilemma (both sides are NOT represented as valuable).Siskoidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08266365376486695812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37940560.post-8217466597358576002008-06-25T11:59:00.000-03:002008-06-25T11:59:00.000-03:00jay--that was sort of my point. The Voyager premis...jay--that was sort of my point. The Voyager premise boxed in the writers: as you couldn't bring in outside sources to be dickweeds, you had to randomly have people behave way out of character in order to provide the dramatic conflict they wanted. Was it worth ignoring 4 1/2 years of Janeway characterization to tell this story, or should they have jettisoned it? (One could argue that this wouldn't have been a problem if they hadn't been trying to write Voyager as one big happy family, and at some point had a humanoid character who was consistently anti-Doctor from the beginning. But that wouldn't have been in line with the "eliminate any potential conflicts by the end of season 1" series mandate)(Of course, they could have gone the usual Voyager cliche way and had brought in some one-time alien race to declare the Doctor had violated Ape Law and must be wiped...)<BR/><BR/>siskoid--"soft" on AI?? Hell, Kirk would have talked him into deleting himself in the flippin' pilot...(it's still pretty cool that 60's TV writers thought you could destroy a computer just by confronting it with illogic...)snellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06181997862745538999noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37940560.post-89370335939666452762008-06-25T09:57:00.000-03:002008-06-25T09:57:00.000-03:00In a sense, it's more Kirkanization of Janeway. He...In a sense, it's more Kirkanization of Janeway. He was always rather "soft" on AI rights. ;)Siskoidhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08266365376486695812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37940560.post-49850133737098339452008-06-25T09:54:00.000-03:002008-06-25T09:54:00.000-03:00But of course, one has the issue that, if Janeway ...But of course, one has the issue that, if Janeway <I>had</I> acted completely rationally and morally, then there would essentially be no plot this episode. I'm glad that we at least get to see her come around and change her mind.<BR/><BR/>Also: EMH episode! Wooo!!Jayunderscorezerohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16611897906121531154noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37940560.post-40848506652817952112008-06-25T09:51:00.000-03:002008-06-25T09:51:00.000-03:00Yeah, this episode was the one that finally lost J...Yeah, this episode was the one that finally lost Janeway for me. If this had happened in season 1, maybe you could buy her initial position. But after years of interacting with the Doctor (not to mention how many times he's saved the ship), it's inconceivable that she could have the position that she initially has here. <BR/><BR/>Yeah, she "redeems" herself, but it's from a position the writers never should have had her in in the first place. Of course, the writers had a dilemma--given Voyager's situation, they couldn't bring in an outsider like Commander Maddox to advocate rebooting the Doctor. Their solution, as it so often was, was to make Janeway act out of character. But by this point, they were doing it so often, her "character" was just however they needed her to behave to make some dramatic conflict for the current week's episode.snellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06181997862745538999noreply@blogger.com