Who Is River Song?

(Containing spoilers for both The Time of Angels and Flesh and Stone.)If you've been reading along with this blog's Series 5 Doctor Who reviews, then you've been waiting more than two weeks for my analysis of The Time of Angels (and now Flesh and Stone). Truth is, I'm not sure what to say because these episodes have been truly MADDENING. Moffat is clearly having fun with the mystery that is River Song, and I'm having just as much fun having my mind screwed with. There's no simple answer to any of it, and possibly there never will be! But before we can even attempt an answer, let's get the personal appreciation out of the way...

I loved it. Some are calling it possibly the best televised Doctor Who story ever, which is of course debatable, but it's way up there. It has the advantage of not unraveling when it comes to production values, which much of the original series' classic stories did, nor fall into the silliness the new series so often dished out. Then again, it can hardly be called a stand-alone story (River, the crack in the universe, the wedding jitters epilogue). Whether the best or not, it has sparkling dialog and performances, mysteries aplenty, comedy derived from the characters and not the situations, a chilling alien threat, lots of tension, actual revelations about the bigger arc, and things that MATTER. From River's mission impossible message to the future to "That's a fairy tale" "Aren't we all?", The Time of Angels/Flesh and Stone is wonderful.
The Weeping Angels could have been one-note monsters not worthy of a return visit, but Moffat adds to their mythology. I'm a bit sorry to see them move, because up 'til now, we the television audience have been able to "see" them and stop them from moving, which I thought was a wonderful meta-textual touch. Other than that, excellent moments for all three recurring characters. There has been some grumbling (to put it mildly) that the final scene, in which Amy throws tries to seduce the Doctor has ruined her character (at its mildest, "oh no, haven't we had enough with Rose and Martha?"). I don't agree, or at least, I'm willing to see where it's going. Amy's not in love or even starstruck. She says she's not looking for something long-term. She's only trying to do something to make sure she can't marry Rory. You don't easily walk away from cheating on your wedding night. It's the classic "trying to make HIM break up with ME". Let's not forget that while Amy isn't the "village bicycle" (going by older people's reaction to her), her job as a kissogram definitely marks her as someone who doesn't give a lot of importance to intimate activity.

The Mystery of the Crack
Moffat is moving this along a lot faster than RTD's Bad Wolf Scenario etc., with important reveals even before the half-way point. If there are cracks (or a moving crack), it's because the universe is going to blow, and it happens on 26 of June 2010 - Amy's wedding day AND, amusingly, the date the series finale will air. Cute. More importantly perhaps is the revelation that the crack is consuming parts of history, which is why Amy doesn't remember Canary Wharf of the Stolen Earth, and why there is no record of a giant Cyber-mech stomping through Victorian London. Is Moffat aggressively retconning the RTD era? Will history be restored by the end of the crack arc, or will we be left to wonder if now Rose never left the Estate? (Or as time travelers, companions would be immune to changes in the timeline?)

Even if Moffat is remodeling the Whoniverse "permanently", we can't cry foul like it's the first time it's happened. RTD's Time War is itself a massive retcon, or doesn't remove the Daleks from history create massive and unexplainable changes? "History can be changed" is not something new to Flesh and Stone, it's been with us since the Hartnell era. RTD himself created paradoxes when he had the Daleks come to Earth long before their invasion in 2163. It doesn't even make sense within New Who itself. Why would Henry Van Statten in 2012 not recognize a Dalek and call it a "Metaltron" if the Earth suffered a couple of big Dalek attacks only a few years before? So it's not just the Great and Bountiful Human Empires that shift, it's us too. It doesn't mean the stories never happened, just that the timeline has. Heck, I don't remember planets in the sky either!

But of course the greatest mystery of all is River Song, and since there's no easy answer to that, the SBG presents:
Who or What is River Song: 11 Possibilities
1. A companion we meet in random order. Simplest explanation and a bit obvious. She has traveled with the Doctor and has therefor had lessons in TARDIS piloting and other skills. As an archaeologist, she would have been interested to learn ancient Gallifreyan. After her actual voyages aboard the TARDIS (she says she's traveled in time and could make good crack food), she continued to meet the Doctor(s) in random order and likes to tease him about his lack of knowledge of her past, plays with his head, etc.

2. The Doctor's wife. She acts like they're an old couple, and both Tennant and Moffat call her his wife in the commentary tracks to Silence in the Library/Forest of the Dead (which doesn't mean anything). Amy spots it right away, so everything points in that direction, which means it's either a red herring or a reverse-red herring to confound the audience. Both the Doctor and River obfuscate on this point, and the Doctor at least, doesn't actually know for sure.

3. A grifter playing the longest con of all. We know she's capable of criminal acts, and in both her stories, admits to being a liar. If later versions of the Doctor knew her from his past, she may be manipulating his younger self. The relationship hinted at would turn out not to be true at its base, but all we have to go on is her lies and the Doctor accepting them as truths. In time, she may have come to trust him and love him, but it all started with a con.

4. The Doctor's killer. Flesh and Stone strongly hints at the idea that her prison sentence was the result of her killing the Doctor (the best man she's ever known). The Doctor doesn't flinch, but does reflect on the possibility of changing history. First, is he really killed-killed? Or is she just responsible for the death of one incarnation, which doesn't matter to the authorities who don't understand regeneration? Second, does she then spend the rest of her life trying to redeem herself by helping the Doctor, drawing his attention to evil, etc.?

5. A dupe. Maybe she isn't the conwoman, maybe she's been conned. Because Doc10 was the first to meet her and there are theoretically only 13 possible Doctors (though I expect that to be easily undone) and presumably, Moffat won't stay on until Doc13 is killed and yet would want to wrap up his River story, we have to wonder about that "spotter's guide". She's unlikely to meet Pertwee or Troughton, though she may have assembled the guide from historical records (lending more wait to her con) and not been given it. Is it possible that all her Doctors are not THE Doctor and that part of her relationship is with a con man, possibly another Time Lord impersonating the Doctor? She might have married the Meddling Monk, for all we know. In this version of events, River is not lying, but neither is she telling the truth, and still, the Doctor can't know.

6. A paradox. My personal favorite is that the only reason River knows his name (to take one example of her intimacy with the Doctor) is that she told him his name in Silence in the Library. He then felt he had to tell her that name (teach her to fly the TARDIS, give her a sonic screwdriver, etc.) because not doing so would change his personal timeline. Moffat is the king of timey-whimey, so I wouldn't be surprised if this was it. She's a self-fulfilled prophecy.

Now let's get crazier...
7. The Doctor's mum. Calling people "Sweetie" is not something that only spouses do. If the dissenting Time Lady in The End of Time was his mother, then her "being lost, once" might refer to time spent as River Song. People have made something of her wearing a wristwatch (Who fans, you're so kooky!). Possible, though the double-entendres are a bit creepy if it's the case.

8. The Doctor's daughter. And even creepier still if it's a regenerated Georgia Moffat. We don't know if his daughter CAN regenerate, but she has two hearts.

9. Another Time Lord. She can fly the TARDIS and write in Gallifreyan. The watch. The attitude. No inherent creepiness in being someone unrelated by blood. A pretty simple idea really, and one might suppose the Susan's grandmother could be out there if you wanted her to be his wife. Other possibilities include Romana (but why would she hide her identity?) or the Rani (who's turned a new leaf after killing the Doctor then regenerating herself). One Time Lord-related character she cannot be is the Doctor-Donna, since she didn't recognize Donna but had heard of her in Library.

10. The Doctor him/herself. He finally regenerates into a woman (Moffat did this in his Comic Relief Doctor Who special), which may or may not be the "murder" of a good man, and having lost his TARDIS in the same adventure, uses himself to right wrongs... or to rewrite them? His greatest failures undone by his naughty feminine side.

11. The TARDIS. Or a second TARDIS grown from the Doctor's. Sentient TARDISes have been a staple of the Doctor Who novels, and we know she's a "she" with an intimate relationship with the Doctor, like some people have with their cars. Crazy? Or crazy-awesome? I'll let you decide.

Which is YOUR theory?

Comments

Tim Knight said…
My current favourite - although it is a bit creepy if you overanalyse some of the dialogue - is the Doctor's daughter.

RTD said the woman from The End Of Time was the Doctor's mum, although it was said on the show, and that's not really a character I'd find interesting anyway. Wife is too obvious.

Love the idea of a sentient TARDIS - it was one of the many great moments in the book Alien Bodies when the humanoid-TARDIS opened up. But I'm sticking with daughter for the moment.
Unknown said…
She's Amy, some years down the line.
Pippy said…
Since Sam Tyler went on to become the master its OBVIOUS that Alex Drake will go on to become River Song.
LiamKav said…
One thing that I noticed: during the bit where Amy's forced to sit still with her eyes shut, and the Doctor starts to walk away but then comes back puts his head on her head and talks to her... he's suddenly wearing his jacket. He wasn't wearing it in the shot before, or the shot after. I suspected that maybe that wasn't actually the Doctor, and the shot afterwards of him walking with the soldier and River made it look a bit like that too. But then nothing happened about that, so either it was a continuity mistake, or some long term piece of wibbly-wobbly.
Lance said…
I think River Song killed the physical Doctor to prevent some terrible infestation or possession. But she found a way--in killing him--of transferring his psyche into her body. It therefore looks like she killed the Doctor but she really saved him. She knows his real name because it's HER name--though she's not a typical regeneration. The Doctor lives inside of her. She can't tell him anything because he might try to change the future, which will lead to all sorts of disasters including the doctors actual death. She's called "River Song" because she's part of the endless stream of history that IS the Doctor.
Unknown said…
I think that she is The Doctor's Daughter by Amy Pond (and not 'Jenny' from teh progeneration machine) and that she herself later has a Daughter called Susan ...
PS said…
one possibility is Susan because as she travelled with her grandfather obviously David Tennant would be the younger version, although this doesnt tie in with matt... anyway you mentioned that Jenny from the doctors daughter doesnt have two hearts, she does, Donna found out when she tried to persuade the Doctor that Jenny belonged with them...
DalekDan said…
After seeing The Pandorica Opens and The Big Bang, my theory which was wavering prior to seeing these two amazing episodes is that she is indeed is future wife. However their time lines (and their relationship?) don't line up until either she's killed 'the best man she ever knew' (him? if so why?) or they line up soon for while and she kills him and (i hope not)he regenerates again next season). - as to the daughter, mother, sister, granddaughter thing, the way she say's sweetie is nothing like any mother or any other close relative ever should.
LiamKav said…
"one possibility is Susan because as she travelled with her grandfather obviously David Tennant would be the younger version, although this doesnt tie in with matt"

You've made the mistake of confusing the age of the characters with the age of the actors. David Tennant's Doctor would be the older version, compared with Susan's "grandfather". He WOULD, though, be the younger version compared with the Eleventh Doctor.
LiamKav said…
"I think that she is The Doctor's Daughter by Amy Pond"

As much as I love the timey-wimeyness of the Doctor having a grandaughter who then travels with a younger version of himself, I really can't see how it would be Amy's. We have no proof that Time Lords and humans can mate like that, and neither character likes the other "in that way". Amy loves Rory, and this Doctor has made clear that he doesn't agree with centuries old Time Lords dating 20-something humans.
Siskoid said…
The last couple episodes really do make "his wife" the best possible answer. Even if not, there's little to no chance she's a blood relation. Not when she calls him "my love" and flirts pretty obviously with him.
SAOIRSE said…
River Song is The Masters wife. When she said IM SORRY MY LOVE that was for not killing the DOCTOR
Mathadox said…
I'm leaning toward River Song being a future regenerated Master...or the wife of the Master as SAOIRSE suggests.
DalekDan said…
A brilliant idea that the masters wife... and id find that pretty dammed cool (and she was probably ruthless), except... unless the masters a polygamist, she's dead, he's dead, and she hates him. The Moff's throwaway comment on confidential about her not being what people expect was meant to make people have different expectations (ie, shes the Rani, she's the tardis, she's rose, himself etc...) so that she didn't live up to their expectations and I'm willing to bet everybody will be wrong when its finally revealed.

whats far more puzzling is why did she go back to that horrible prison so willingly? Its hard to imagine her being easily captured after the big bang, and why does she stay when she can escape so easily.
LiamKav said…
"unless the masters a polygamist, she's dead, he's dead, and she hates him"

We don't know that the Master's dead. There's about 50 ways you could write him back into the show after "The End of Time". And even then, she could be his wife from a different point in the Master's timeline, especially since her whole deal is being constantly on the wrong time-train-tracks with the regulars.

Maybe she went back to the prison because she wanted to serve her time for her crimes, and with no end of universe saving emergency then she's happy to go back?
DalekDan said…
good point, and I'd like the master to come back, he's a proper villain, just not as River Song. You can't deny that his wife hated him. Further back in Lucy's time line she would have looked younger or the same, not like river; so if she was the master's wife shed have to be another woman. (i was under the impression that Lucy died when she thwarted the masters resurrection). Though I'll give you that this is Doctor Who and anything at all can happen.

I think your right about willingly going back, though the way she talked about it in time of angels and the many hinted at attempts at gaining a pardon suggest she'd rather be any place else. I personally think she either helped the Doctor fake his own death and is doing the time to make it look good, or she killed one of his regenerations was locked up for it and is trying to redeem herself. OR....there's something about the Storm Cage Facility regarding the silence, (prisoner 0? I wonder where he was contained?).
The Paradox theory is a pretty good one too and mixes well with several possibilities.
DalekDan said…
oh, i see what you mean about the masters timeline. earlier wife... not lucy. possible, but out of character for the master but not any more out of character than the doctor having a wife mind you so yeah you got that one
Anonymous said…
I personally believe that River Song is not all we expect, and probably a villain. In the big bang, the Dalec assumes she will show mercy as she is 'an associate of the doctors' but she says 'I'm River Song... check.your.records' i.e rebuking the dalek's comment of Mercy or her being an associate of the doctors/
DalekDan said…
where deleks are concerned not even the doctor shows mercy. nor davros for that matter (usually). 7th doctor rememberance of the daleks epsidoe.
Davros: 'have pity on me.'
Docotor: 'I have pity for you.'
on other occasions he obliterates them without a second thought, the 5th doctor in resurrection of the daleks. a bit hypocritical if he doesn't like the idea of her killing a dalek. Oh and then there's Ace, daleks should be scared of her too.
I think river is like catwoman to the doctors batman, a villain or ex-villain who cares for him and who he cares about and even comes to trust. Making a dalek beg for mercy was awesome though.
Rich Scales said…
hmmm great insight. I am a little puzzled however........you say the doctors daughter cannot have 2 hearts? however didnt she come back to life and fly the spaceship? (his "cloned" daughter?) and if she is only half time lord, then having 2 hearts wouldnt be a neccesity....maybe she just had the power to regenerate by heling who she already is (tennant did this too rememember)
I also had a thought...........is river song actually the doctor himself?(herself?), RTD always wanted a female doctor.......however Moffatt although hasnt used a female entirely, he could have the inclusion that the doctor at some point, regenrates into one. Then when the earth reboots, she (he) never existed because she never needed to (she wouldnt have had the need to regenerate) By her saying she killed the best man she had known.......was she talking of her previous male "version"?
just a thought.
Siskoid said…
I'm sorry about the "two hearts" thing, my mistake. She does have two.

However, she doesn't regenerate at the end of the episode. Some of the genesis energy that revitalized the planet came out of her (NOT regeneration energy like we've seen the Doctor breathe out, GREEN not yellow). Her resurrection was just a side-effect of making the planet bloom.

I doubt it would be feasible for the 11th Doctor to regenerate into Alex Kingston and then for the show to keep going. She doesn't have her own TARDIS, etc. Anyway, if you have seen The Pandorica Opens/The Big Bang yet, I won't spoil anything, but comments she makes there do not work with the "she's the Doctor" theory.
Gammera said…
How about the Doctor Donna?
Elliot said…
I know this is a long shot, and most probably not going to happen, but this is a sci-fi series and I guess anything can happen.

What if River Song is Miss Hartigan from 'The Next Doctor'.

I was just watching that episode once more, and though she died in the end, there could be plenty of ways to bring her back to life or something.

Then there was the scene where Miss Hartigan says her first name was Mercy. When the Daleks checked their records, they kept saying mercy...of course the Dalek could really be begging for mercy, but who knows maybe he was just calling her by her proper name.

We must also recall Mercy Hartigan was given knowledge of the universe, making her extremely intelligent and with a brilliant mind, just like River Song.

Plus, Mercy Harigan is a villain, and I am gonna bet River Song will be a villainous character turned good when we meet her.

This theory is a hugeeeee long shot, but it was fun thinking about it.

I have a feeling the rose tyler theory might hold true...and the wife theory is too obvious [though they will be married in the end, in my opinion]. Plus, if River Song is Rose, then she most probably married the other doctor in the other world too.
mess_in said…
Face of Bo's child?
Eli said…
Here's my wild guest: River is Amy's and Rory's daughter. And maybe the good man she killed is Rory himself.
Anonymous said…
My theories:

1)She is 'Patience', wife of 'The Other' .

And at some point the doctor breaks the Galifreyan law of not going back in time Lord history. Perhaps he cannot be detected because of the timelock.

He travels to the point in time and realizes he is destined to be the Other. During that time he came to the Galifreyans and meets Rassillon and Omega. He meets a woman who is somehow important. During that time he thinks Rassilon is good but eventually sabotages Omega by hiring the Mercernaries so not to be discovered, the Doctor finds out and because he is the only one who has a TARDIS he and Patience flee in the Tardis, leaving That era of Gallifrey to Rassilon alone who goes on to create the Rassilon Imperitus.

However Patience does not have this because they fled. Although she is Gallifreyan she will never regenerate.

They travel together, writing her Diary, eventually she wishes to leave.

She wants to see the universe and know the universe so she leaves the Doctor and the Doctor knows that he will see her again and sad, because he knows how it will end.

He ends up meeting her in his many future regenerations. Probably because they are so close.

in his last incarnation he pops up, finds he has Daughter, Daughter is Susan, discovers his 11th incarnation trying to protect River Swan and a child he thinks is Just River's

he ends up having to protect her from his enemies and finally understands, he remembers the first place he went in his TARDIS, the Galifreyen space port,

before he takes her, from the year 5124, while the child is very young
girl, the doctors last incarnation is chased by both river and the 11th, both are astonished to see him running into a much more worn TARDIS, but before he gets in River shoots him, the 11th chases into the older TARDIS while the security detains river for Murder

The TARDIS disappears and inside the 2 Doctors fight, the 11th not knowing that he is fighting his last self. The TARDIS Lands which and the doors open.

Allowing Toddler Susan to run away from the fighting. Eventually the youthful 11th is knocked out. the last doctor chases after Susan taking her and fleeing.

11th wakes up and gives pursuit and is horrified to see a dying Doctor giving the toddler to the first doctor. He stays hidden realizing this is a fixed point in time.

As this is a time of civil war the spaceport looks ruined and the Last doctor describes himself as being a casualty, the 1st Doctor takes the Child and asks of her name. THe last doctor says 'Susan'

Exit the first Doctor the 11th approaches the Last and they talk about how last doctor hates it because he remembered it. And remembers being the younger.
Siskoid said…
Super interesting fanfic, but I wouldn't call it a potable theory. There is no way the tv show is going to do something that complex and that reliant on continuity, especially stuff from the books like The Other.
Anonymous said…
I personally feel that River is the Master. If you remember back to when the Master returned and took the place of the Prime Minister. When the Doctor defeated him, his ring fell off. The hand that picked it up was a woman's hand. And put it on. River could possible be the Master. This wouldn't be the first time the Master took on another person's body. Since he has used up all of his regenerations.
Siskoid said…
I guess you didn't see The End of Time?

Because we see who the woman was, and how the ring is used to bring back the (male) Master in that.
LiamKav said…
Also, the new series implies that the Master has a new series of regenerations anyway.
Anonymous said…
I go with the Patience theory, twisted. It is Omega who wants the silence to fall, destroying all reality. He was a fine man (the finest man?) before the creation of time travel. If River Song is revealed as Patience, she could be easily seen as a villain, only to later be revealed as a true heroine who did what she had to do to stop catastrophe, even at the expense of her husband. That revelation might be enough to make the future Doctor love her completely.

Later resolution of the issues with the Other could be left to later regenerations of the Doctor (and future writers) to resolve. But here's a possible twist. River Song ends her physical life saved in electronic form within the Library -- which would be perfect for retrieving and tossing into the Matrix which eventually produces the Doctor himself. (That, neatly, does not require that it happen for many series yet, right up until the end of the13th doctor, and does not require that Alex herself still be available to play the role.)

River Song could be wife to Omega, wife to the Doctor, and, without yet knowing it or doing anything creepy, ending up as the Doctor's "mother" as well.

Why this idea? In the preface of the BBC ebook Lungbarrow, which supposedly laid out a past "master plan" for the series and sets forth the Other portion of the show's mythology, someone asks what a mother does and asks if they spawn in a RIVER like a SINGfish.
Anonymous said…
spawn in a RIVER like a SONGfish.
Siskoid said…
While that's a neat clue, I think you're going to be disappointed. This is all much too convoluted and tied into extra-canonical material (highly controversial material, at that) to ever be green-lighted for the television series.
Anonymous said…
Perhaps, especially the Mother in the matrix part, which even if it happened, would be nothing concretely planned now. Just an opportunity for future writers.

However, Omega is a canonical Big Bad well established before the show revival, and the kind of villain certainly caple of hijacking a TARDIS. Means, motive, and opportunity.

Patience could be MADE canonical by the current writers.
Siskoid said…
He's also canonically DEAD (Arc of Infinity), so invoking canon doesn't really help. Of course if they brought back Rassilon...

That said, the theory in entangled in stuff regarding The Other, etc. which will not be make it to television. It's just too much for mainstream (and even much of fandom) audiences.

And while Omega might return behind the Silence, that doesn't mean it'll tie into River's identity. It probably wouldn't. The revelations about River have to be satisfying for the audience because they've been sticking with her for more than 2 years. Say the revelation is that she's the reincarnated wife of a classic series baddie just now returned... That's not very satisfying to New Who audiences. Again, intriguing fanfic, but that's not how the series works.
Anonymous said…
I never saw Arc of Infinity, but after your comment I looked up the Wikipedia entry on the serial. The entry says Omega was expelled back to the anti-matter universe, not killed.

You make very good arguments, but they have another full season to set up Omega, acquaint the new fans with his place in the mythology and the Tine Lords' origins, and set up the reveal of River Song.

I would also note that SM has gone out of his way in 2 of the 13 Matt Smith episodes to get pictures of the first doctor on-screen, not just the ninth or tenth. I think that's a hint as well that the villain lies back in early time Lord history.

For that matter, the Lord of Dreams seems to be a post-racial return of the Crystal Gaurdian ' Toy Master, so I think SM is very interested in reconnecting the eleventh doctor to the whole overarching time lord metaphysics.
Siskoid said…
Time will tell. It always does. Let's meet back here in a year so you an tell me you told me so. :-)
Anonymous said…
You have an interesting blog. I'm sure I'll be back before then.
Doctor fan said…
I believe "River Song" is a future "Amelia Pond"...their names are both bodies of water; Amy is "special" according to The Doctor. And the man River kills; the 'finest man she ever knew', could be Rory. For some yet unknown reason, Amy must kill the man who waited for her for 2000 years, and she is imprisoned for it.

Also, "Amelia" is a song with these lyrics:

The drone of flying engines
Is a song so wild and blue
It scrambles time and seasons if it gets thru to you
Then your life becomes a travelogue
Of picture-post-card-charms
Amelia, it was just a false alarm

People will tell you where they’ve gone
They’ll tell you where to go
But till you get there yourself you never really know
Where some have found their paradise
Other’s just come to harm
Oh amelia, it was just a false alarm

I wish that he was here tonight
It’s so hard to obey
His sad request of me to kindly stay away
So this is how I hide the hurt
As the road leads cursed and charmed
I tell amelia, it was just a false alarm

A ghost of aviation
She was swallowed by the sky
Or by the sea, like me she had a dream to fly
Like icarus ascending
On beautiful foolish arms
Amelia, it was just a false alarm

Maybe I’ve never really loved
I guess that is the truth
I’ve spent my whole life in clouds at icy altitude
And looking down on everything
I crashed into his arms
Amelia, it was just a false alarm"
Siskoid said…
I like that guess.
Anonymous said…
in the big bang, theres all that mention of the silence/silence will fall, the fact her name is river song... (song being the important word) kinda gives me the impression somehow the silence and river are connected. AND she apologises to the doctor because "thats when everything changes" i really dont think she's his daughter, or granddaughter. we're all supposed to think she's his wife... but i think she might turn out to be, river kicks ass. especially dalek ass.
Anonymous said…
If the Cracks in time were negated by the Doctor rather than simply closing, it is possible that Prisoner Zero never escaped from its prison. (DW: The Big Bang)

River could be Prisoner Zero.
She also could be in jail for "killing" Jack. Or, is Jack, aka, Face of Bo.
Siskoid said…
I wouldn't personally bring back Prisoner Zero for that.

As for the Face of Bo, it survives to the Year 1 billion +.

Rory and the Doctor are more likely to be her victims, I think.
Anonymous said…
ok, random long shot here....deos anyone remember when the Doctor cremated on Master on a funeral pyre? i can not remember which series that came from or what the episode was called...anyway...i do remember that at the very end of the episode a woman's hand picked up a sonic screwdriver (i think it was the Master's) and then started laughing just before the credits rolled? Was that ever explained? Was that River Song? I'll be honest when i say that it's pretty much a vague memory, so if anyone can shed some light on this I'd really appreciate it.
Siskoid said…
Yes, the lady who rescued the ring in Last of the Time Lords showed up again to help resurrect the Master in The End of Time.
Anonymous said…
I vaguely remember an interview somewhere where SM said that the Big Bad had been present in the Matt Smoth first episode "in unconventional form". Is my memory correct?

If so, were the toys, books and dolls eventually revealed to be the elements of the Pandorica trap visible in the first ep background of Amy's room somewhere?

Although the consciousness of the Autons built the humans for the Pandorica trap from the toys, is it possible that they also reanimated an element of the Celestial Toymaker himself, since that Big Bad's last appearances in DH involved being trapped in his own toys?
Alan Gibson said…
Steven Moffatt loves long story arcs, and he also loves to put clues right in front of your nose.

Note that in 'Flesh and Stone' he actually showed you the Doctor talking to Amy after escaping from the Pandorica (Doctor with coat), betting you wouldn't notice.

He also told you River Song's real name in her first two appearances... 'Silence in the Library' and 'Forest of the Dead'... Her real name is Forest Silence. (Silence was in the Library, and then Forest dies and joins the dead spirits).

He is also hinting heavily to her origins, introducing her as 'Doctor' River Song (notice that River Song is an anagram of 'Version GR')(and 'GR' is an abbreviation for the Theory of Relativity regarding 'Time and Space').

Also he has used the word 'angel' in every episode River Song is in: either in the title, or as a character name (Miss Angelista), or a sentence said in the episode.

Silence (Forest Silence aka River Song) will fall... for betraying the Doctor. Because she is the spirit of the Tardis, a Time Lord's ghost that embodied it throught the entire series.

Quote: River Song: [reading the end of the book] "What if we had ideas that could think for themselves? What if one day our dreams no longer needed us? When these things occur and are held to be true, the time will be upon us. The Time of Angels."
Anonymous said…
I'm really sure River is not going to be Amy, Susan, Jenny, or the Doctors Mother. I think there is an off chance she could be Romana or the Rani, but I don't think it's either of them. After watching season 5, I feel like the only logical conclusions are that she's his wife or that she is tricking him into thinking she is his wife. Everything points to wife. The problem is that DW has been a TV show since 63 and the format is for the Doctor to travel around with companions who change every once in a while. He doesn't travel with a wife. So, while I believe she is or will be his wife, I expect SM will do some bad thing to her becasuse she can't be traveling with him on the show. I'm of the opinion that Omega is returning and that River is his wife or daughter. Oh, and I also think that in the Series 5 finale, River didn't know what was happening to the Tardis until after she heard the voice, then I think she knew. One final thing - let me just say that River is such a great DW character! I started out hating her in the library episodes, then in series 5 I changed my mind. I like River so much now that I'm really sad knowing they are probably going to finish her story arc and will likely get rid of her in series 6.
Anonymous said…
Did you know, that an anagram for Professor River Song gives the words 'gross prison forever'? Perhaps it has no meaning at all, but it's interesting at least. Let's see what is coming!
hannah said…
I bet she is Jack/boe's daugher. Torchwood is coming back next year, which could create a good crossover episode. It was mentioned in "New Earth" and in some season two episode of Torchwood that he got pregnant...
Anonymous said…
Sentient Tardis works for me, better than a future regenerated Doctor.

Doctor retrieves River Song from the Library archive and downloads her into the Tardis.

Tardis could become sentient, more than an organic technology. River Song infused into the Tardis. The Tardis already is pretty infused into the Doctor on some empathic level. That's why he can now just snap his fingers to open the door.

Honestly, guys and their gadgets. What are you gonna do. Have to just get into gadgets, don't you. DW just gets literal about it.
Anonymous said…
Now I can move on--mystery solved on River Song, regardless of what the actual show's writers come up with. It's resolved best like this: Doctor bonds with River Song, avatar of the Tardis, because I don't think there will be a "last" regeneration for the Doctor. He doesn't know it yet, but he contains too many paradoxes and whatever energies enable time travel. If the show has to be canceled, best to have him wearied of time and trouble, longing for release from endless battle. Unfortunately, very possibly, we will learn that the Doctor pretty much is going to have to exist as long as Time does. The regenerations are the only paradigm for immortality in fiction that solves the ennui problem. Shudder to think of an immortal and powerful Caligula, for example. Sounds like a DW episode, "The Gibbering Perv Menace"

Sad, very important moment on Doctor Who was when the Tennant one stayed for Christmas dinner with a Dickensian quixotic guy who thought himself to be the Doctor. At the end, The Doctor says he doesn't want a companion because they always break his heart.

So, River Song is the ultimate resolution for the series. I'll enjoy seeing how the "real" canon solves it!!
Exayevie said…
My best guess is that she's a personification of the TARDIS, drawn out and given a form after some event we'll see in this upcoming series. My reasoning:

1)There have been some really obvious allusions to River being the Doctor's wife. But Moffat has also made it very clear, both in interviews and on-screen, that the Doctor is "married to the TARDIS."
2)She can pilot the TARDIS even better than the Doctor (could her joke about the Doctor being "busy that day" not really be a joke at all?)
3) It would explain how she knows Old High Gallifreyan.
4) It would explain how she knows the Doctor's real name.
5) The TARDIS exploding is responsible for the entire universe, and the Doctor, being erased from time. That would certainly explain who she killed.
6) It's worth noting that "River Song" is an odd name for someone who's entirely human. Take that how you wish.
Exayevie, Cont. said…
Oh yes, it also explains where she got pictures of all his faces and why her journal is shaped like the TARDIS
Anonymous said…
She cant be a timelord as the doctor would sense it, unless she turned herself human though talking about timelords would break the spell turing her back to timelord,again unless her fog watch was broken, humm. we'll find out in the 1st ep of the new series anyhu. cant wait.
Anonymous said…
I cant believe nobody has mentioned the Ood who says to the doctor (tennent) ''your song will end soon''! Is it something that everyone was duped into believing in that it is something to do with the music playing in the back ground or is it river song? claretboy007
LiamKav said…
I don't think anyone was supposed to think that it was to do with the background music, since that would be an extremely odd thing for a character to mention. I'm sure the Ood was just speaking metaphorically. It wouldn't have worked quite as well if Ood Sigma had said "Your regeneration is ending, but the overall story of Doctor Who is going to go on for at least as long as the show remains profitable".
Siskoid said…
To the Anonymous whose post I just deleted: LiamKav's comment feels in no way like an "attack" and your message had offensive language in it that did make it one. Let's try to be civil gang, thanks.
Anonymous said…
I think the Doctor is going to turn bad in the next series and possibly river song will have to do something to destroy his darker side. Which we see in ''Amy's choice''. At the end of the episode the Doctor's reflection is that of the Dream Lord. And then maybe the Doctor has to be reborn. (maybe from Amy?)Also the voice who says ''silence will fall'' in the big bang episode sounds very much like the Dream Lord I have a loads of theories and I really want to know who she really is before I go insane lol.
Phire42 said…
No one has mentioned the possibility that she is THE MASTER!?

I don't see how no one has thought of that possibility
LiamKav said…
People have, including Mathadox about 1,000 posts above. (I'm being nice, honest!)

I thought the "Silence will fall" voice sounded like Davros, personally. I can see no reason why it would be him, but the voice definitely sounded similar.
Anonymous said…
The voice that says ''silence will fall'' is definitley not Davros and I agree with it sounding like the Dream Master.
Anonymous said…
How about Rose and Meta-Crisis Doctor's daughter? Would explain all her knowledge. She could've also killed the Meta-Crisis Doctor to prevent him from doing something like wiping out the Daleks.
Anonymous said…
I have heard rumours that Amy will be pregnant in the next series I wonder if this has anything to do with river song or as posted above the doctor being reborn.
Anonymous said…
River could be Zodin? That would be awesome.
Siskoid said…
If the truth has to be an obscure reference to the classic series, then I want it to be that one!
Anonymous said…
I don't think she is a blood relative cus of the flirting and especially how she is with him in the 2 libary episodes.I'm not to sure myself...but in every episode she has said sorry to him so i'm really confused.I'd like them to be married but have a twist within that which would make it not what was expected.
Cloama said…
I can't even try to guess. Whether she turns out to be good/bad/complicated, I still love her.
Anonymous said…
That book she carries looks like a TARDIS. It's not a diary. She's a TARDIS repo man. Those are her ownership records. She's going to take the TARDIS away from the Doctor.
Don H said…
I think she is the daughter of the human doctor and rose tyler...
Anonymous said…
I have seen the eighth doctor played by Paul McGann, In that one it is found out the doctor is half human. River Song could possibly be the Doctor wife, In the old episodes Susan is the Doctor granddaughter. She stays on a different planet in a later episode. Romana was left in e-space, River Song mention have all his pictures of him but not sure what time frame. This suggests could not be the TARDIS, as it would know all the order. The doctor and the master were kids together. River song kills with a gun. This tells me she is not the future doctor. She knows the doctor name, which was told to her by him, this means it could not be his mother. His daughter is alive and has two hearts, when she was created from the doctor. She was killed within 48 hours which is within enough time to have the residual effects of a time lord to come back as suggested by the doctor when he lost his hand. He has not met River Song as of yet because he did not know who she was in the library. This tells me when he meets her for the first time to her she will not know who he is. This tells me that it can not be any of the others he has already met. I.e. Amy, Donna, Martha, Rose. She can not be Time lord because she dies. Could she be the Master some one had said I say no. The Master knows all his order and did not need a diary. Who is River Song, let see, she does kill when needed, She very smart, at one point in time she becomes a professor, but didn't know it until the Doctor introduce her as Professor River Song to Amy Pond. The Doctor can see time forward and backwards of what was, what is and what could be, but does not know who she is. She is some one from out of his perception, Romana is a maybe if being in e-space changed her in some way but I doubt it, doesn't mean that they could not bring her in though. River Song mentions she had never seen him so young, was she talking about his eyes or his face, the first time they met he might have been old. The three oldest at the time of their reign was William Hartnell, Jon Pertwee, and Patrick Troughton, Sylvester McCoy and Richard Hurndall who took over for William Hartnell in the Five Doctors. They could bring in the other Doctors that are still alive. She could be from a different reality all together who met one of them. River Song is someone the Doctor has not met at this point in time for her first time, She is not any of the ones you all mention, she could be one related to one of them who over time took notes of him which is where the diary came from past down to her. This would explain why she would not know what order he is in.
Angel said…
In the episode "Last of the Time Lords" a woman's hand picks up a ring that looks like it belongs to a time lord. It has the markings of the time lord watch. We believe that the Master has regenerated into River Song. In the episode "The Time of Angels" Amy asks the Doctor if River Song is going to be his wife and he says Yes. My husbands theory is that because there are no more time lords, that one would have to be a female to make future time lords. Therefore River Song is the Master and is going to marry the Doctor in the future to make more baby time lords.
Siskoid said…
That only works if you haven't seen The End of Time in which we discover who the woman's hand belongs to.
Anonymous said…
Anonymous reminded us that River said she had never seen the Doctor so young and that this meant his eyes or his face. It was his eyes - I know this because I saw an interview where it was revealed that Matt Smith was chosen because his eyes are "old"
LiamKav said…
It would pretty much have to be his eyes (or "soul", if you will), since the Doctor had had younger faces than Ten before (such as the Fifth Doctor) and much, much older (such as the first).

Of course, this seems to imply that River had never met any incarnation of the Doctor prior to the Tenth. Which begs the question as to exactly which Doctors there are in her book. Since Alex Kingston is aging, they can't really show her opposite the Twentieth Doctor in 30 years time, which is a bit of a shame.
Anonymous said…
I have heard rumours that ''the silence'' is a character who is bad. Also heard a load more rumours but don't want to spoil for people but OMG!!!
Anonymous said…
I thought she could also be a sentient tardis for the following reasons.

1. She has technical expertise that surpasses the doctor. She fixed the teleporter to save Amy from the Angels when the Doctor said it couldn't be done. She can also pilot the tardis better than the doctor himself.

2. When she received the phonecall from churchill in The Pandorica Opens, she refers to the Tardis as "she." Additionally, the Doctor referred to the new Tardis as "you sexy thing."

3. She can speak and translate high Gallifreyan, the lost language of the Timelords. The Tardis can translate virtually any language, and of course, is a Timelord invention.

4. The only companion that the Doctor has had throughout his regenerations is of course, the Tardis.

5. The Doctor's heart belongs to freedom, the ultimate escape, best exemplified by the Tardis.

6. While being technologically more advanced than the Doctor, River is not as creative or intelligent.

7. River did not understand the cracks in time, something that likely would not be comprehended by the Tardis which is a relative dimension in time and space.

8. River has mentioned that she has dated other technical lifeforms such as androids and Nestenes.

9. River's diary looks like a Tardis.
Anonymous said…
I think there is a possibility it may be Captain Jacks daughter???
When Rose and the Doctor(Eccleston) first travel to platform 5 we here that the Face Of Boe is pregnant and then when we first meet River Song she has the exact same squarness gun that Captain Jack had......Just a thought???
Siskoid said…
Could be. However, while Jack's gun had a different handle, Moffat has said he meant for it to be Jack's, left in the TARDIS in The Doctor Dances.

It's the Doctor who pulls it out first in an earlier scene. I didn't come from River.
Unknown said…
Any possibility that she is the daughter of the face of captain jack.
Anonymous said…
amy POND - RIVER song..

river is amy's and rory's daughter.. ;)
Anonymous said…
"the silence" are OMEGA and his soldiers.. OMEGA returns..
and river is the key..
Anonymous said…
"the time of angels".. just take a closer look at the soldiers' uniforms.. you will notice the omega sign on their arms.. including river song
Slee said…
Okay, everyone forgets that she's written off quickly. She knows multiple doctors (and note that there is no reason she couldn't know future doctors out of order, even if she were to be a fairly stable companion, even wife of any versions of the doctor.) As an independent time traveler, River can marry 11 or 12 and still kick it with 13 on occasion, but all within a limited time span, because ultimately, she goes on a field trip to a library and ends up having her consciousness transferred after her body is dead.

As per being incarcerated for killing the best man she ever knew. Maybe it's the doctor, maybe she kills Jack in some super-final way so he can stop having to suffer on. Maybe she kills someone else, but in any case, she's clearly choosing to serve her sentence, which implies she's not longterm evil, maybe just wild and evil youth villany.
I like her for the Doctor's wife though. It feels temporary without finality, and she has the fire he so often stops himself from feeling.
Anonymous said…
Omega is coming back deffo.
Anonymous said…
Who's for the Doctor being prisoner zero?
Faz said…
my theory about who River Song is: she built the Pandorica. She may not have done it out of choice, but this would give a reasonable explanation as to how she killed the "best man I've known" (obviously the Doctor), without him actually having to die. This would also be a good reason why she says sorry to the doctor several times in the run up to Big Bang(2)
Anonymous said…
Actually, I think that it's not the Doctor River kills, but Jack Harkness. Think about it. River says that she killed one of the greatest men she knew. Jack's pretty great. She has the sonic gun and the time watch thing (which might be a coincidence, but I don't think it is), just like Jack. And at this point in time, we don't exactly know what's up with Jack. It's implied that he's become the Face of Boe. I think that River is def a companion of the Doctor's and his eventual wife, but I think her killing Jack Harkness would be what lands her in prison.
Of course, there is a possibility that she kills the Doctor. Let's face it; the Doctor's running out of incarnations. I have a feeling that if she actually DOES kill the Doctor, it will have something to do with getting him more incarnations.
Siskoid said…
While it doesn't by itself invalidate your theory, it's the Doctor who has takes the squareness gun out of the TARDIS in Library (presumably left by Jack after Empty Child), and she gets the vortex manipulator from a dealer at the start of The Pandorica Opens.
Anonymous said…
River Song could be Merci Hartigan. The dalek was screaming ''mercy'' in the big bang 2
Abi Rose. said…
could river song be an anagram for someone he's met in the past??
Anonymous said…
I think personally it is someone very close and personal to him, i.e his wife, daughter, mother or even just a close friend. In the library when she tells him his name and shows him his screwdriver he hints at that he could only ever share those things with a person he is close to. Personally I think she is his wife, or perhaps a future menifestation of Rose? Like when he says "theres only one time I could.." and we all know the doctor was madly in love with Rose.
Anonymous said…
Or she could be the Rani, what with the rumours that Omega is coming back.
Anonymous said…
I would love the TARDIS Song idea. And the whole River killing the "best man" she ever knew, I think is most likely to come up in S6. Because, Come the episodes after easter. there are the episodes with the clones. and I know that the doctor gets cloned (I think Amy has to choose again) which doctor is real. Watch the newest trailer. And It is said that the first two episodes are "all about river song", all thought the Patience idea would be amazing! remember they have a whole 6 episodes to thrill us before the Cliffhanger. Side note! Idris is back!!!
Inn said…
My money's on Romana personally. But I've come to accept that there are some faults in my theory:

A) River claims that the Doctor taught her how to fly the TARDIS. Romana already knew how, sadly.
B) How on Earth did she survive the Time War? Yes, there is the fob watch thing, but how would she have gotten one?
and
C) Why the big act? Why not go ahead and tell the Doctor?

My idea was that maybe Romana was the one who killed all the Time Lords and not the Doctor, but that's a bit too far-fetched.

On the other hand though, she could have changed from Time Lord to human and hid on Earth. Perhaps she met up with the Doctor while she was in human form and started travelling with him, not knowing who she was or that she already knew the Doctor....

But don't listen to me. I'm sure there are crazier theories out there on the web.

She better not be Rose though. I'm absolutely sick of Rose by this point. Back when I was watching Series 1 & 2, I did like Rose a lot. But by the time they showed David Tennant's last episode, I was throughly sick of her. She's nice and all, but I'm kind of tired of the whole, "Lost Love" thing. Move on Doctor!
Siskoid said…
Dramatically, we have to think about Moffat's position, which many theories don't take into account.

If you're working from the whole of Who, then yes, there are many possibilities (from Patience in the novels, to Romana to the Rani to the terrible Zodin). However, I don't think Moffat is playing with the whole of Who. He has a responsibility to today's viewers who, by and large, don't know Classic Who as well as some of us do.

Similarly, RTD played out his story and those characters have been put to rest, and the actors have moved on. Moffat must get out from RTD's shadow, as well as respect the finality of that era. No Rose, then.

From my perspective, River's reveal won't be that she's a returning character (that would harm the character Moffat's created) but rather that we will discover her nature (friend? foe? con artist? time loop? wife? not? living TARDIS? Time Lady? etc.)
Annabeth713 said…
personally, I like the TARDIS theory. She really can't--or at least SHOULDN'T be a relative of the Doctor's, because they were making out in the trailer and let's face it...ew. It's been hinted at that she has SOMETHING to do with Jack--they even mentioned it in the Brilliant Book of Doctor Who. So here's what I'm thinking: the TARDIS becomes a person, but halfway through the process, is half-human-half-machine and therefore doesn't understand things from an emotional viewpoint. Jack might try to kill someone because that person killed Gwen or someone, and the TARDIS, knowing that the Doctor doesn't approve of that, tries to stop him but goes to far and kills him. The Doctor is furious, and it's not until she's fully human that she realizes who it was she killed and how bad that was. Though this doesn't explain the blaster/vortex manipulator thing, that might just be like a flag to get us to notice the connection, know what I mean? SM said "if you want to see the life long love of the Doctor, that's the TARDIS," which explains the wife thing.
I like this theory. Anyone else agree? i will probably see the fault in it in about three days, but until then, it seems very realistic!
Inn said…
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said…
oh! those are all good ideas, I like the Idea of her being his mum, but... eh, i prefer the idea of River being the TARDIS.
Anonymous said…
Well I don't know who she is, but I do know that she's not the Doctor's wife (at least not in the typical wifey-way), because in the Library eps. she tells him about the last time they met (and probably when the Doctor gave her the [blue, now green?] sonic screwdriver).

She says that he "showed up on her door" and took her somewhere awesome, where he cried(something like that, he obviously knew she was dying). I think this means that they don't liver together in the future nor is she a future companion!


Sometimes I even think she stole the diary from the real Doctor's wife (Susan's grandmother, maybe).
Anonymous said…
Does anyone remember Nyssa from seasons 18-20ish? It was unclear why she left the doctor, but didn't she become professor? Also, I'm not sure, but I think that she had met one of the previous Dr's before traveling with him or something like that. I think she also traveled with Adric, whose death deeply affected the Dr. If she had become a professor, and had been with a previous Dr. before traveling with him, It could be River Song now. The two characters do seem to have a bit in common and it would make sense to tie her into some of the older characters. It wouldn't be the first time they brought back old characters from the Dr's past. Just a long shot, but fun to think about.
Avenging World said…
How 'bout this:
River Song is an archaeologist who studies the Doctor.
The Doctor has always 'run silent', but she writes the book on him, exposing him to wider scrutiny.
At some point in time, people were bound to notice his presence among them, like Clive in 'Rose'.
River is his biographer.
Unknown said…
I think the idea that River is related to Captain Jack somehow is interesting..but Captain Jack and his adventures have already ben explored so much,I don’t think the current writers would want to keep going back to it..with each series and each set of stories,the story archs move on and even though they cross over breifly or feature an appearance by an old friend, I feel like they generaly come up with new ideas/stories/reveals…which is also why I don’t think she’ll be someone reuturning from the old series, River's identity is been built up for the new series and they’d have to make it someone known and relevent for the newer audience for it to be an effective surprise….
sooo....
My theory: River Song is a personification of the TARDIS’s personality that became real and separated away at some point (possibly the same point she “kills the best man she knows”)…..she is then able to travel off on her own adventures….
Its known that the TARDIS is a living thing,with a deep connection to the doctor. He understands and feels what the TARDIS feels, and there are running jokes of how “intimate” he seems with it ("does he still stroke the TARDIS""Hello, do you want to be alone"),and in the “Ultimate Guide” it was described as his “real lifetime love” (and as a “her”)….She knows what buttons do what (even when the Dr doesn’t – “they’re just…blue…”) and what the noise is when it lands….The interact like as old married couple, which is how he treats the TARDIS anyway...As for River:
Her diary is in the shape of the TARDIS,and she has intimate knowledge of a lot about the Dr…maybe she forgets the detailed.scientific info over time as she becmes less and less like her mechanical self, to explain the information that she DOESN’T know ….
He’s had so many love interests throughout recent years,that I couldn’t understand throwing in another “love that could never be”…how many times do they have to show that ultimately the Dr’s life is a lonely one, every love-interest he has is "true-love," what would separate the love of a future wife from the relationship he had with Sarah Jane or Rose?.... maybe when River came along it started as romantic, but just wasnt the same after she wanted her own travels and ambitions.......
and maybe later she is “Doctor Song” bc of a connection, the way it was “Doctor-Donna” ….Also,it may explain why the TARDIS blew up in The Big Bang and almost destroyed th universe (since supposedly you can not travel in time and come into physical contact with yourself…maybe it took repeated exposures to build upand finally set off a reaction)…
Also,since Rivers supposedly the person he trusts “the most in the universe” I don’t think it would be Amy in another guise (why would he trust her any more than other companions in the same universe..such as Donna,Martha or Sarah Jane)…I’ve read that Amy could be his daughter,and even though he’s said that he had children once,and Genni was his daughter (although she was “generated” and not “born”) and you’d think that the concept had been done to death, maybe she is his daughter with River (still sticking to my theory that “who and what” she is is the TARDIS which would be enough of a spin on Amy being the Doctors offspring that its not completely redundant)..except the River doesn’t seem at all interested in Amy at all. She’s not cold or anything towards her,but she certainly doesn’t interact with her as if they are some combination of mother/daughter/ancestor or alternate forms in anyway. Also not believing that she’s The Master or any incarnation of the Doctor,it would be too creepy with the “my love” and “sweetie” stuff….
it sounds a lot more far-fetched than it actually is, esp considering a show where literally anything at all (ever) can happen...
Alice said…
After seeing ''The Impossible Astronaut''
my theory has kinda changed.. :

Amy's unborn child = little girl in space suit = River Song

Because:
River said she killed a good man(doctor)
she could be that little girl in the spacesuit who kills the doctor in the doctors ''future'')

(eleven is NOT her doctor) (according to River)

Moffat said we would get to see river as a child in a interview.

River is from the future, so.. if you think about it.. amy is older then river. (THINK ABOUT IT)
(Amy is from 1986/1987) (River is from.. the 51st century)
Anonymous said…
This is a long shot, of course, but could River be Jack? He has flirted with the Doctor before, and pretty much everyone else he has ever met. There was a reference in Torchwood in which he said he was pregnant once, and he would know how to use the Time Agents device. And perhaps the man he killed was not the doctor but himself. Jack could also be pretty freaking ruthless, might even scare a Dalek.
Anonymous said…
I like the TARDIS/River Song theory, with a twist. the heart of the TARDIS in the body of Amy's unborn child. aslo River and Pond are both bodys of water.
Anonymous said…
I think River Song is Romana, due to her escape from E-Space she is in reverse order with the Doctor....The man she kills is JFK...Doctor Who first aired on JFK's assassination..The first episode of the new series featured Eccleston observing JFKs death..Although there are many hints she killed a man that the Bishop didn't want to let him know of, I highly doubt they would lay this much effort into her character considering the first introduction of River shows her to be romantically linked to him (negate incest here) talking about the last day they spent together.
Anonymous said…
I think River is Amys Daughter...somehow... i dont know, i just have a feeling. and the best man she ever knew that she killed is the doctor. remember their first meeting? she was in a astronaut suit... the doctor got killed from someone in an astronaut suit...i am really excited on what the real story is...
Anonymous said…
River said she killed a good man, best man she ever knew. She loves the doctor but she knows he is not a good man. Honestly I think that River kills Rory who sacrifices himself to save them all once again and then River makes a promis to the Doctor to pay for what she did.
Anonymous said…
I'm wondering if Doctor River Song isn't "Doctor" - River Song Time Lord. This would make the girl in the suit River. The first time she meets the Doctor would be the time she kills him since their lives are traveling in opposite directions and would be the last time he shes her right before his death.
Anonymous said…
if you look at IMDB 'a good man goes to war' jenny appears to be back but not in the second part..hmmmm i think river song is the masters daughter! after giving birth that saxon woman put the girl in an orphanage in the past to hide her but the silents found her as she is part time lord and did something to her; trying to awaken the time lord part of her?? Anyway, she is adopted by amy and rory...
I know theres an episode later where river calls amy 'mother' and lucy saxon was on imdb 'agood man goes to war' but it has been removed as has sydney wade (astronaut girl) playing young lucy saxon ????
HOLES IN MY THEORY...why was there a photo in the orphanage of amy pond holding a baby?
usssagan said…
Ok hang on I think I have it. She is Amy's daughter. For most girls the best man they have ever know is their father. So I think she kills Rory somehow and is raised by the doctor and Amy in the Tardis or perhaps Amy dies as well and she is raised by the doctor in the Tardis. When River says that your gonna meet me soon now I think she is refering to the Birth of Amy's daughter.
Barbara said…
alright, haven't watched this Doctor's series until the last weekend when I'm catching up on all of them, but, in the IMPOSSIBLE ASTRONAUT, when River is describing to Rory the worse day to come, she says, "my doctor", just as Rose once did. Is River Rose? I think maybe.
Anonymous said…
Riversong is CAL's mother. The good man that Riversong killed was her husband. The family agreed that he would go with CAL so she wouldn't be alone while Riversong tried to find a cure for CAL's disease.
Anonymous said…
According to the culture magazine from last week's Sunday Times, Amy's baby is called Melody Pond.

Melody Pond - River Song?

You see what I'm hinting at?
Melly said…
Oh my god! Just watched the "Good man goes to war" episode and only two or three people picked it:
River Song = Melody Pond = Amy and Rorys (and the tardis') daughter and I hope the Doctors Wife.

Someone suggested River Song = Silence Forest which adds a third alias but really it still makes sense- the alien race of the silence praise Amy for "bringing the silence" which must refer to River. The role she plays in the doctors life is still a mystery but I reckon she kills him as a child- at the control of her life support space suit prison, she gets imprisoned because she's a weapon- not for killing the doctor, but she sort of allows it because she regrets being used that way to kill "the best man she's ever known!"
I'm confused though cos that means the bad guys win... Unless, by her later association with the doctor they change time as she gets free before she kills him? The doctor knew where and when he dies so he is probably told by a scared and young melody pond!

The ood tell the doctor that his song will soon come to an end and even though it was a later episode it may have been an earlier time period, thus referring to the death of "his" song Aka sweety/love/wifey?

How did they get a hold of Amy and why are they scared of the doctor (warrior)? Who is that girl he met that virtually gives river her name and where are the gamma forests?

And was that the real Rory or the last centurian Rory who is also a living plastic?

And of course the doctor had kids... He had a granddaughter called Susan and has a clone daughter called Jenny.

My head is spinning! So much to discover! But I really really want to give a huge round of applause and cheers for River song being the doctors best friends daughter!

Did you notice how quick he disappeared after discovering who river was to them? Like he was suddenly afraid of his in-laws?

And I bet river knew the whole time! Smarty pants! Amy was jealous of her own daughter! : p
Siskoid said…
To be fair about the guessing, this was posted in May of last YEAR, and most people in the thread consequently did not have the crucial information about Amy having a daughter AND it still doesn't answer exactly who River is to the Doctor.

To answer a couple of your spinning questions: That's the real Rory as there's no evidence that he would be an Auton here. And yes, River knew "the whole time" because the whole time, she was from this story's future. So this had already happened for her.

I fully expect the Doctor to escape his death, most like with a flesh duplicate. Turnabout is fair play.
DalekDan said…
Lol about running away from the in-laws.

I think too many people over-thought the River plot, and thats why i've seen so much negative feedback elsewhere. I loved the episode my self. Good writing is not making someting overly complex or bizare or odd, even in doctor who. SM really made the most out this little tid-bit and really hammered home the emotional connection. On the second play through i just loved how much it seemed like River was telling Rory about her birthday trip the way a little girl would tell her dad.
Siskoid said…
I completely agree. Too many expected some kind of return from the Classic series (or even from RTD's) and I knew for sure that would never happen. Her identity (and still plenty of mysteries surrounding her, so it's not like that's over) would be about her role in the regulars' lives, not a SPECIFIC person.

It's sure going to be interesting rewatching River's appearances now. Her first (from our POV) meeting with Amy and Rory now seem particularly suspect(?).
DalekDan said…
Suspect? I think I know what your getting at but I'm not sure.

I think river is a bit of a cold fish at times, but she has shown at least concern for her parents safety before both for Amy in Flesh and Stone and Rory in The Impossible Astronaught. Possibly not as much she could have. River will not let her parents (if they really are (i believe her mind you) get in the way of what has to happen. Prior to this moment there was the risk of the doctor sucessfuly saving her before she was turned into a weapon. Before the big bang there was the possibility of Rory and Amy being careful not to concieve in the tardis to ensure their child when they did have one wouldn't be stolen, this would likely mean she wouldn't exist. Of course River could always be a flesh duplicate but I think that's been done to death over the last three episodes.
DalekDan said…
oh yeah and Rivers doulbe and tripple entendres actually come true. In the impossible astronaught she said 'i'm quite the screamer, theres a spoiler for you.' Considering river's personality and such this seemed rather rude until she was baby meldoy.
With that in mind... what do you make of her reply to Rory's comment about there being two doctors; 'now that's a whole different birthday.' again, particularly due to her expression some adults might misinterpret this ;p
Siskoid said…
You're right that lines take on another meaning post-revelation, and that's what'll be fun about revisiting the series.

When I wondered if some things would be suspect, they were things like River calling Rory "that Roman" in Pandorica, but then, he didn't exist in that reality (yet she did?). Very much open to interpretation of course, which is why it's so good.
DalekDan said…
Since the doctor was unaffected memory-wise of rory when he ceased to exist (because he's a timelord?) it stands to reason that River knew exactly who he was, and just didn't care to let the doctor or anyone else know. It'd be like: 'River...how do you know Rory?'It's too big a universe for the doctor not be puzzled, even unnerved by that knowledge prior to her reveal.
DalekDan said…
SM tweeted this comment in reply to someone who asked why she doesn't remember the details regarding being a little girl in the space suit unless she's lying to Amy and Rory (and him?). He replied: 'Listen to River Song's dialogue in Silence in the Library.'
Worryingly the bit i think he hinted at was 'I was lying, I'm always lying.'

This raises just as many mind-numbing questions though:
Why lie? what does she gain by lying about her identity (if she lied) to Amy and Rory?
So howcome the girl sews the prayerleaf that translates her name into River Song?
And why does the Tardis tell Rory that the only water in the forest is the River (which she quoted word for word)?
This might give credence to the imposter theory again... i really hope he was just yanking their chain.